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Substance Painter Tutorial – Model Preparation 05: Mesh export options

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In this video we discuss FBX export options and when to export tangents in the FBX file. Support thread: https://forum.allegorithmic.com/index.php?topic=6297.new#new
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Text Comments (54)
Ayush Bakshi (25 days ago)
I'm new in interactive texturing (done texturing in Ps on UV templates only). I was wondering why user have to make ID meshes? Isn't there any way for software to keep the objects separate as they are in the 3D application?
Substance (5 days ago)
The ID meshes are just so that you can bake an ID map. Sometimes this is very useful for masking. In Painter, the objects can be separated by material ID, but this is not the base way to work as the material ID will create multiple texture sets.
Adam Janz (5 months ago)
Another great series, thank you. I'm wondering what the benefit / advantage is of leaving triangulate unchecked for the FBX export of the high poly and ID meshes?
Adam Janz (5 months ago)
+Substance Great; thank you for your reply and the helpful tip. @2:16 you show to leave triangulate OFF for the export of the high poly (only the low poly was exported as triangulated). I was wondering if there was a particular reason you did that, or if it's fine to export both the high and low poly meshes as triangulated. Thanks. :-)
Substance (5 months ago)
Thanks! When baking normal, it's best to bake with the triangulated mesh. You want to bake and render with the same triangulated mesh. Different software will triangulate the mesh in different ways so by exported the mesh triangulated, you can be sure it will be the same order for the bake and render.
Terry Rhuebottom (6 months ago)
OK so quick question. If I was creating textures for Renderman would I change any settings like the Tangents and Binormals
Substance (6 months ago)
That is a good question. I'm not really sure on this one. I'm not sure if it uses Mikktspace for calculating tangent space for normal mapping. IN this case, you could export the FBX with tangents and Painter will bake using the mesh tangents. From there, you will not need to worry about it for rendering with renderman.
Villeum (8 months ago)
does the low poly need only 1 smoothing group when exporting to SP or can it have multiple and will that make the bakes ok? its just the little details like these that always screw me up in the end.
Substance (7 months ago)
You can have mulitple smoothing groups. This video shows the smoothing groups and baking. https://tutorials.allegorithmic.com/courses/516b0dc3c0e6ec89eb36c6b448ac6d04/youtube-gR3r7Xmhmlk
Lorenz Yagong (9 months ago)
Why do you need low and high poly model whats the purpose of that?
Substance (9 months ago)
The low and high poly is just for baking a normal map. You don't have to do this. It's only if you need a normal. Please check our latest course that textures using the high poly asset only. https://tutorials.allegorithmic.com/courses/a97b433a5997fd800b5ed300d783cc41/youtube-IGGQl9kVB1M
Schenier Lopez (1 year ago)
Hey there, how are you guys? Hope, you fine. I'm wondering how can I do differents (or multiple) UVs for a single mesh, just like the crate, you have 2 UVs one for top and other for bottom. I made my object: a mail post which has differents objects, and all of them have their own UVs, but when I select all and export the mesh I have a error which is about UVs problems (UVs are one over others). I don't know if you could understand my question but if you did, how can I fix it? Any video or PDF or website?. Thanks you guys (substance support and YouTube community). Regards! :).
9000halNASA (1 year ago)
can i use export maps for standard use in maya and attach them there without artefacts?
9000halNASA (1 year ago)
Tnx, sir.
Substance (1 year ago)
Yes. Please check our rendering docs for more information. https://support.allegorithmic.com/documentation/display/integrations/Rendering
Andrea Giglio (1 year ago)
Wonderful video. I've got a problem with my fbx exportation from Maya to Substance Painter. I've created 7 lambert materials and I've assigned it to the several components of my mesh. Then I exported the fbx and I clicked to embed media under the embed media tab. If I open the fbx file in Unity I can see the different materials, yet if I open in Substance Painter I can see just one Texture Set. Is there another way to include a material while exporting my .fbx file? Thank you!
Substance (1 year ago)
This should be working the same with export from Maya. In the FBX export preset settings, make sure that materials is enabled.
Daniel Belmont (1 year ago)
If you separated the whole mesh into pieces, does that mean that you have to make UV Mapping again? you know because the Mapping looks diferent when all it is together
Substance (1 year ago)
No, you don't have to redo the UV mapping. If you UV'd while the mesh was together, then the UVs would not be overlapping. Separating the mesh still keeps the UVs in the same location. Painter will actually separate the UVs based on Material IDs so even if you have overlapping UVs it won't be an issue as long as the UVs have different materials.
Presque vu (2 years ago)
If you are just working with a single low poly mesh and don't need the detail from a high poly version, do you need to still put the low poly mesh in the High definition meshes field, or just bake the normal map without adding any mesh there?
Substance (2 years ago)
I'm sorry for the confusion about the normal map creation. We can now bake the other maps without having to use the normal. For example, you can bake the AO, curvature, position maps from the low poly mesh that is loaded in the project. These maps are used for the generators. You don't need to bake a normal map or import a normal map from another program.
Presque vu (2 years ago)
But in the Fundamentals tutorial it says other maps are generated from the normal map, even if you are only using a single low poly mesh. So, if I am only using just a low poly mesh, does this mean I need to create the normal map in another 3D app and add to Additional maps? Can't it be created in SP?
Substance (2 years ago)
If you are just using the low poly, then you don't need to bake the normal map. The normal map can only be baked from the high poly. You can disable the normal baker, but still bake the other maps such as AO and Curvature for use with the generators. You don't have to use a high poly mesh. When the high poly mesh is left blank, then the mesh you loaded as the project mesh will be used in the baking.
kreion (2 years ago)
this doesn't work for me at all. I have the lowpoly meshes named X_low and the highpoly named X_high etc, exported the fbx 2014/2015 files, set the match by mesh name option in painter, but when i bake the normals it projects information from one mesh to another, so it simply doesn't work... i have no idea what am i doing wrong, i do the exact same thing....
Substance (2 years ago)
This should be working. Can you post in our forums or send me a PM message on the forums with the meshes. I would be happy to take a look.
Chris Browne (2 years ago)
how do I import shaders from maya/arnold into substance painter?
Substance (2 years ago)
You can't import maya/Arnold shaders. You can output textures from Painter for use with Arnold. https://support.allegorithmic.com/documentation/display/SPDOC/Arnold+for+Maya
Polygon (2 years ago)
Im curious why I cant have tangents and bi normal's selected when exporting out of maya.. If I let Maya calculate this, wouldn't painter respect those settings, as well as Unreal when importing?
Polygon (2 years ago)
Awwe makes sense. thankyou for the response. I really wish there was only one type of normal out there. Its looking like mikkt will be it. hopefully
Substance (2 years ago)
You could export the tangent out of Maya. If Painter see tangents in the FBX, then it will use those to compute the normal. However, both Painter and UE4 are using Mikkt for the tangent basis. So letting Painter compute the normal insures you are using mikkt which will match UE4. If you use the tangents in the FBX, then you will break the sync between UE4 and Painter. You would then need to tell UE4, to use the tangents in the FBX. So at the point. you are doing the same thing where you are having both UE4 and Painter use the tangents in the FBX. I think it's just easier to let Painter and UE4 use mikkt.
eka eka (2 years ago)
Hi,i have problem with exporting FBX file,i working on maya 2016 ans substance 2.0.5. Any help would be appreciated.
eka eka (2 years ago)
Tnx I got it!!
Substance (2 years ago)
It's probably the 2016 FBX version. In the Maya FBX settings, change the fbx version to 2015. We don't support 2016 FBX yet.
Jintaro Kensei (3 years ago)
So let me see if I got this. 1. Make a HiPoly and blow up the parts close to each other. 2. Make a LoPoly, do the same as above. 3. Unwrap the LoPoly (or is the High here?), scale the UV's for texels. 4. Add a material to chosen LoPoly parts, these are the texture sets. 5. Duplicate the Lo (or Hi) Poly, and add materials to be used as ID masks, these will be a separate fbx, not on the LoPoly. 6. Import to Pianter, bake the normals and all the other jazzy maps, using the diff between the _high and _low to battle the ray problem. 7. Paint 8. ???? 9. Profit. That correct?
Jintaro Kensei (3 years ago)
Looks very nice, you opted to model the details rather than paint them in. And I see you used plenty of Dirt :D Seems like it's your favorite along with rust.
Substance (3 years ago)
+Jintaro Kensei Thanks very much! I really appreciate it and I'm so glad the videos are helpful. You don't need the high poly. It's only used for the normal map bake, but if you are painting on a "high poly" mesh anyways, you don't need to bake normal. For the mask generators, you can bake AO and Curvature from the mesh without adding a high poly mesh. Just ignore the high poly warnings when it's left blank. For curvature options, set the algorithm to Per-Vertex and it will bake from the mesh. Here is an example project where I didn't create a low poly. I did the high poly model in Maya with UVs and exported straight to Painter. It was a 3 million poly mesh. I then baked AO, curvature and positon from the mesh and painted in Painter. https://www.artstation.com/artwork/xZAAO
Jintaro Kensei (3 years ago)
Oh yeah I got the blowing up thing, I meant dissect the mesh into components far away. Sorry. But man, the amount of effort you put into those videos, and to respond to comments is highly commendable. I mean, post a comment on one of Maya's "tutorial" videos and see if it gets responded...ever. Thanks again for this series man, I very much appreciate it. One last question, do I really need the HiPoly then? I mean, the model can be like with 100 extra quads, and still work no?
Substance (3 years ago)
+Jintaro Kensei Yes, that is correct. You don't have to move the mesh high and low parts away from each other though. When you "blow up" the parts, you are just breaking the mesh parts into layers. Previoulsy, this technique would require you to actually move the mesh parts way from each other where only the high and low intersect to avoid intersection errors in the raycast. For example, the head_low and head_high are on separate mesh layers and they will correspond to each other using the suffix _low and _high. Since the name "head" matches, then it will only bake those two mesh layers. The high res mesh doesn't need UVs at all. Only the low res mesh will contain UVs.
Michael Witkowsky (3 years ago)
10/10. All this tutorial is amazingly well done, produce and informative. Thanks for knowledge and your time doing this.
Substance (3 years ago)
+Michael Witkowsky Thanks very much! So glad you like the training. More to come.
Nestor Lichev (3 years ago)
Great Tutorials! Very informative! What is the reason you don't use cages for your bakes? In what situation would you use cages?
Substance (3 years ago)
+Nestor Lichev Thanks! Its just a preference as I didn't want to spend the time to make the cage. If I was having many issues with the raycast, I may use a cage. For me, its faster to try a few different settings for max frontal and rear distance then build the cage.
TheGamingKiwi1 (3 years ago)
so does this allow you to texture specific parts in substance?
Substance (3 years ago)
+TheGamingKiwi1 You can see how this works in the Substance Painter Tutorial: Scifi Crate Project. It is part of the Substance Painter tutorial series.
TheGamingKiwi1 (3 years ago)
sorry i meant do you have a tutorial on your comment?
TheGamingKiwi1 (3 years ago)
ah. do you or can you make a tutorial on painting specific parts of a mesh?
Substance (3 years ago)
+TheGamingKiwi1 You can't edit a substance specifically, but you can use substances or custom substance materials you create as base materials that can be built upon using layers.
Andrea D. N. (3 years ago)
Hello, thanks for providing such useful information! One question: how important is to triangulate for working in substance painter/designer? Can one just let UE4 do the triangulation at the end of the pipeline when importing the meshes to UE4?
Andrea D. N. (3 years ago)
thanks for clarifying
Substance (3 years ago)
+Andrea D. N. Thanks! Its best to use the same triangulated mesh to bake the normal as well as view the normal. If you only let UE4 triangulate, there there could be an issue since the mesh was baked with a non-triangulated mesh.
Dangelo L. Old Page (3 years ago)
man these tutorials have been great! ive learned so much with them and have a better understanding when using painter. After this, on to the scifi crate project which should solidify the learning with a hands on project! cant wait for the Substance Designer version! you guys are awesome!
Substance (3 years ago)
+Cognitive Studios Thanks very much : )
Alex Szaloki (3 years ago)
these baking tutorials are very good! very!!!   however it would be amazing to see a similar course that covers substance designer from the fundamentals. not even the node networks but just getting set up and how to prepare the meshes for it etc.
Substance (3 years ago)
+CZOKKA Thanks! I will make a similar course for Designer. However, the process is the same as both Painter and Designer handle meshes the same way.

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